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Kingdom of Atenveldt Home Page

Kingdom of Atenveldt
Heraldic Submissions Page

(administered by the Brickbat Herald)


Unto Their Royal Majesties Cosmo and Elzbieta; Dame Anita de Challis, Acting Aten Principal Herald; the Heralds in the Atenveldt College of Heralds; and to All Whom These Presents Come,

Greetings from Marta as tu Mika-Mysliwy, Parhelium Herald!

This is the August 2009 Atenveldt Letter of Presentation. It precedes the external Letter of Intent that will contain the following submissions that are presented here, asking questions of submitters and local heralds who have worked with them; if these questions are not addressed, the submission may be returned by the Atenveldt College of Heralds. I accept online commentary, in addition to questions pertaining to heraldry and consultation. You can send commentary to me privately at or join “Atenveldt Submissions Commentary” at Yahoo!

( ) and post there. (Any commentary is likely be included in the next month's Letter of Presentation so that all may learn from it, and we can see how additional documentation or comments may have influenced a submission.) Please have commentary to me by 10 September 2009.

August Heraldry Hut: Helena de Argentoune, Deputy Parhelium Herald, attended the August meeting. Also attending as heralds and/or interested parties were Nest verch Rodri ap Madyn (Mons Tonitrus), Séamus mac Ríáin (Tir Ysgithr), both who are continuing their armorial education by attending Heraldry Hut, and Elnor Howard (Wealhhnutu), who just like hangin' wit' da heralds.

Submissions Website: You can send electronic commentary on the most recent internal LoIs through the site, in addition to any questions you might have. Current submission forms (the ONLY forms that can be used) can be found on the site. Please let your local populace know about the site, too:

College of Arms Actions: The results of the May 2009 S.C.A. College of Arms meetings (submissions found in the 25 January 2009 Atenveldt Letter of Intent) are included at the end of this report.

Please consider the following submissions for the September 2009 Atenveldt Letter of Intent:

Alexander of Korinthos (Twin Moons): NEW NAME

Alexander is a Latinized version of a masculine Greek name, found in “Common Names of the Aristocracy in the Roman Empire During the 6th and 7th Centuries,” Berret Chavez ( ). Corinth is a city in Greece. It flourished in ancient times, and it was conquered by Philip II of Macedon in 338 BC, but it was named the meeting place of Philip's new Hellenic confederacy. After Philip was assassinated, Alexander the Great immediately came to Corinth to meet with the confederacy, confirm his leadership, and forestall any thoughts of rebellion. At the Isthmian Games of 336 BC, the Greeks chose Alexander the Great to lead them in war against the Persians ( ); it remained inhabited from the Roman times onward. While initial questions as to whether the name “Alexander of Corinth” might be presumptous because of The Alexander (the few heralds who commented online didn't think so), knowing that his father conquered the city, and his son was an important part of the confederacy based there, it might be wiser if the client might consider the name Alexander the Corinthian, suggesting that he was a native/long-time resident, rather than someone who came there, particularly as a conqueror. He might consider adding an element (perhaps a patronymic) to distinguish himself from The Alexander. Why, yes, I am being paranoid: Alexander of Tyre's name submission was returned November 2005 (and he was given the holding name Alexander of Mons Tonitrus) becauseThis name is presumptuous of Alexander the Great. In general, the combination of a ruler's name and the land they ruled is protected. Tyre was one of the ancient world's great city-states, and Alexander the Great was its ruler after he conquered it in 332 BC. Therefore, the name Alexander of Tyre is protected.”.

The client desires a male name, and is most interested in the language/culture of the name. He would like it to be authentic for the language/culture of Greece. The Greek spelling Alexandros is dated to 1322 in “Personal Names of the Aristocracy in the Roman Empire During the Later Byzantine Era,” Berret Chavez ( ). Based on information from S. Gabriel Report 2362, in which “the (female) Corinthian” is Korinthia ( ), the male equivalent is Korinthios (I Greek course in college was a long time ago). The fully Greek form, Alexandros Korinthios, is confirmed by Ursula Georges.

Brian Ambrose O Driscoll (Barony of Atenveldt): NEW DEVICE

Lozengy vert and erminois, a commedia dell'Arte mask between three Bowen knots argent.

The name was registered June 1998.

While several “commedia dell'Arte” masks are found in the Ordinary, I don't know how close this matches any of them (and they are old pieces of armory). Some documentation on this particular mask probably wouldn't hurt to include to Laurel, as there are several standard characters (and specific masks associated with them) in commedia dell'Arte.

Chavezs MacTavish (Ered Sul): NEW NAME

Chavezs is the client's legal given name; a photocopy of his driver's license is forwarded to Laurel. MacTavish is cited in Black's The Surnames of Scotland, p. 566. This is not enough documentation (at least at the present); the Atenveldt CoH's copy of Black went missing at Estrella this year, and it hasn't turned up, so I cannot verify the citation or the date of this particular spelling. Considering that fairly recent submissions of MacTavish were changed in order for the names to be registered (Matheus McTaevis McMychel in the September 2003 LoAR; Edward MacTavisch in the December 2007 LoAR), there's a good chance that this is a post-period spelling of the surname.

The client desires a male name.

Cordelia Vivinia McNaught (Barony of Atenveldt): NEW NAME and DEVICE

Argent, a brown-haired mermaid erect to dexter proper tailed and maintaining a sword fesswise reversed purpure in her dexter hand and a round shield vert in her sinister hand, a ford.

Submitted blazon: Argent, a mermaid proper, brown hair blowing to sinister, tail embowed to sinister purpure, armed with a sword in chief fesswise to sinister purpure quillioned vert bearing a green shield vert above a fountain.

The documentation for both Cordelia and Vivinia comes from the website “Behind the Name”. PLEASE GOD PLEASE DO NOT USE THIS AS A SOURCE! The names are pretty much universally not dated, and it's generally an electronic baby name book. (Maybe we should consider renaming the Medieval Name Archive as “The SCA's Big Ol' Baby Name Book,” given the affinity folks seem to have for such sites...)

Cordelia is cited there as a possibly a “Celtic name of unknown meaning.” It is a character in Shakespeare's King Lear, which does not make it SCA-acceptable.

There is a fairly recent registration of the name, in June 2008 via Aethelmearc; thanking heavens for the OSCAR archives, the Aethelmearc February 2008 LoI documents this as: “Withycombe cites the burial of one Cordelia Harvey in 1636 in St. Martin-in-the-Fields. The LoAR of November 1995 states: “Cordelia must be given the benefit of the doubt: according to Withycombe, it was in actual use by 1636, and close variants can be found in period, at least in literature. [LoAR 11/95, s.n. Cordelia Wynne]”. The client seems to be safe with this documentation.

Vivinia (spelled Vevinia on the name form but Vivinia on the device form – what does the client want?) is cited as “Italian, Spanish, Ancient Roman.” Colm Dubh's “An Index to the Given Names in the 1292 Census of Paris, ( ) shows Vivien as a masculine given name (one of those names that seem to be male until the 20th C., when they become associated with women and males with it are laughed at).

McNaught is documented only through the Internet Surname Database ( ), which at least provides some dates (it looks like this citation was liberally cribbed from Black's The Surnames of Scotland. The earliest date associated with McNaught is 1733 (MacNaught dates to 1700).

The client desires a female name, is most interested in the sound of the name, and wishes it to be authentic for a 13th C. French woman marrying and Irishman. She will not accept Major Changes to the name. I think getting this name to be authentic is very unlikely.

This is a convoluted blazon (common with humans and humanoid monsters, particularly those clad or maintaining charges). As she is facing to dexter (head in full profile) and body not completely affronty (erect affronty is the default posture of merfolk), I think blazoning her to dexter is somewhat more accurate (and may avoid possible issues with the torso in a slight 3/4's view). While I think the waves in the ford should be drawn with more depth, the fatal flaw here is the “proper” mermaid. In period armory, proper humans and humanoid monsters (the pink, Caucasian types) could have as commonly been depicted as argent as “pink” or “beige”. As a result, this is a tincture violation with the field. (The hair is a very light brown, almost a dirty blonde, and this could be an issue, too. A brunet human is fine, but the tincture should be the basic “brown,” or darker, seen in a box of crayons.)

While I'd tend to ignore the sword and shield because they are maintained charges and do nothing to contribute to avoid potential conflicts, be aware that there are six tinctures (argent, azure, purpure, vert, proper/brown and proper/skin tone) and four charge types (mermaid, ford, sword, shield) in this design, for a count of 10. This “hangs together” well, since two of the charges are maintained and there are really only two major charges, and if the tincture issues could be remedied, I think the “excessive” number could be argued.

Donicia del Lunar (Barony of Atenveldt): NEW NAME and DEVICE

Per chevron purpure and vert, a chevron between five mullets and a unicorn's head couped Or.

Donicia is the client's legal middle name (photocopy of driver's license to Laurel). Del Lunar is a Spanish locative surname from the late 15th C, found in “Spanish Names from the Late 15th Century: From the Account Books of Isabel la Catolica (1477-1504, mostly 1483-1504), Locative Surnames,”Juliana de Luna ( ). The client desires a feminine name and is most interested in the spelling of Donicia.

The chevron needs to be thicker (barring conflict, it could also be removed to provide more space for the other charges. The mullets look like they're “edging” the shield, which is a prohibited practice (unless this were a complete orle of mullets), but this might be acceptable if blazoned as a field purpure mullety Or (a few more mullets would be advisable in that case – would the client consider that?). Consultation with the client shows that she does like the chevron and would like to keep it (and will make it thicker) if possible, and that the number of mullets isn't an issue, so that a semy would would well for her. Please bear these things in mind when conflict-checking, as they might be to her advantage if a conflict pops up.

Gideon the Weary (Barony of Atenveldt): NEW NAME and DEVICE

Per pale argent and sable, a dragon and a griffin segreant addorsed, tails entwined, counterchanged.

Gideon is a masculine Hebrew/Biblical name, one of the four judges of Israel in the Old Testament. The concept of weary being very tired or fatigued appears c. 825; this spelling is noted at 1684, with earlier spellings as wery and wearie (Compact Oxford English Dictionary). The client desires a male name and is most interested in the meaning of the name. He will not accept Major Changes to the name.

Jean le Loup (Barony of Atenveldt): NEW NAME

The name is French. Jean is a masculine given name found a number of times in “Names Found in Ambleny Registers 1578-1616,” Mari Elspeth nic Bryan ( ). le Loup is a descriptive byname, “the wolf.” The most recent registration of this byname was in 1998, to William le Loup, when it was registered without comment. The client desires a male name. He'd originally intended to submit his legal first and middle names (Ian Phelan) but was discouraged from this by the number of Ians and Phelans out there (it also would've been a mixed Scots-Irish Gaelic name); what he has is a single-language name with the elements that mean “John Wolf”.

Marielle Johanne de Lisieux (Barony of Atenveldt): NEW NAME and DEVICE

Per chevron azure and argent, two needles inverted crossed in saltire argent and a cross flory sable.

Documentation for Marielle and Johanne comes from the website “Behind the Name”. PLEASE GOD PLEASE DO NOT USE THIS AS A SOURCE!

The name was submitted on Branch Name Submission forms. With God as my witness, I have no idea where these came from.

Johanna is a Dutch feminine given name found in “Dutch Names 1358-1361,” Aryanhwy merch Catmael ( ). Lisieux is a city in the Burgundy region of France; its 12th- to 13th-C cathedral was partly rebuilt in the 16th and 17th C. ( Britannica Online,

). The client desires a female name, is most interested in the sound of the name, and would like it authentic as a 13th C. French name. She will not accept Major changes. With the 13th C. French name sources available at the Medieval Names Archive, the closest elements I can find are Marie, Jehane and Jehanne.

Sorcha Broussard (Barony of Atenveldt): NAME and DEVICE RESUBMISSION from Laurel, December 2008

Argent, a skate sable and on a chief azure two escallops argent.

Submitted blazon: Per fess azure and argent, two escallops argent and a skate sable.

The original submissions with the above name and the device submission of Per fess azure and argent, on a fess Or between two escallops argent and a manta ray sable a rose gules. were returned for the following reasons:

“The name is returned for administrative reasons. The documentation for the byname was inadequately summarized on the LoI; no information was provided about what the source said about Broussard. For further information on what constitutes a proper summary, please see the Cover Letter of this LoAR.

“The device is returned for excessive complexity. The Letter of Intent noted that this device has a complexity of nine, which is beyond our rule of thumb limit of eight, except for designs which are considered to be good period style. Several commenters noted that the manta ray is New World fauna and its use is, therefore, a step from period practice. Precedent on manta rays says:

“'Blazoned on the LoI as a skate, the primary charge is instead a manta ray, which is distinguished by its two "horns". We have no explicit period citations for the manta ray, but it lives in waters frequented by the Spanish in period; we are giving it the benefit of the doubt here. If the submitters would prefer to resubmit with a genuine skate (as their order name would suggest), they could do no better than to copy the depiction of a skate in the Macclesfield Psalter, c.1330, as seen at [Tir-y-Don, Barony of, 11/05, A-Atlantia]'

“More information was discovered during research for this submission: manta rays are surface fish known to exist in the Mediterranean, so they are not New World fauna, whose use is an automatic step from period practice. Unfortunately, there are still no period citations for the existence of manta rays, meaning that we would still be required to give the submitter benefit of the doubt in order to register this device. Since it would require this benefit it cannot be considered good period style, and so the device must be returned.”

[The URL for the museum cited above is a dead link, but takes the viewer to several of the Psalter pages: look for the one titled “The Giant Skate Fish,” which is evidently so scary that the little fellow looking at it in the illustration seems to be losing all control of his bodily functions.]

Sorcha is a feminine Early Modern Irish Gaelic given name dated 1480 through the end of period in “Index of Names in Irish Annals: Sorcha,” Mari Elspeth nic Bryan ( ). Broussard is found as a French family name in Dictionnaire etymologique de noms du famille et prenoms de France, Dauzat, p. 70 s.n. Brousse. The citation is not dated, but there is a castle in southern France by the name of Brousse-le-Château. It is situated on the Tarn River and the area was occupied since Roman times; in early years, its residents charged people the right of passage, on its advantageous position to cross or go down the river. The village of Brousse itself is on the confluence of the Tarn and the Alrance, where at the top of the old part of the village is the 12th C castle. The castle was built on the rocky outcrop by the Counts of Rouergue. ( ) While the Brousse citation is undated in Dauzat, it seems reasonable that Brousse could've been a period locative; the reference to Broussard is defined as a “pejorative”, leading me to believe that a resident of the village/area, being called Broussard, might've been the equivalent of connoting a person from the country, or someone who lives out in the boonies (a rustic).

Please check for conflicts with the design using a charged chief and as a Per fess... division of the field. I will contact the client and ask which design she prefers/which is less likely to run into conflicts (and if she wants to stay with the ray or if she might be interested in the 14th C. depiction of a skate).

Susanna Broughton (Barony of Atenveldt): NEW NAME

The name is English. Susanna is a feminine given name documented several times with several spellings (including this one) in “Late Sixteenth Century English Given Names,” Talan Gwynek ( ). Broughton is a locative byname found in “Women's Names in the First Half of 16th Century Wales: Elements Appearing in Women's Surnames,” Tangwystyl verch Morgant Glasvryn ( ).

The client desires a female name. She will not accept Major or Minor changes to the name. In spite her vehemence (for lack of a better term), I love this name. All elements are found in . They are dated. I love this name.

Tamsyn Stanford (Ered Sul): NEW DEVICE

Erminois, two cats combattant sable, on a chief gules three mullets Or.

The name was registered October 2007.

The original submission, with an Or field, ran into a quick conflict. I contacted the client and suggested an erminois field. She is amenable to the change, which clears that particular conflict.

Tatiana the Midwife (Sundragon): NEW NAME CHANGE

The client's currently-registered name is Tatiana Gordeevna Kazimirova, which was registered in July 1999. If the name change is registered, she wishes to retain this as an alternate name. The Midwife is an occupational byname, a woman who assists other women with the birth of their children. According to the COED, the term comes into the English language in 1303, and this particular spelling is found in 1592. The Lingua Anglica allowance should allow the use of the English form of “midwife” (no, I don't know the Russian term for it, but I suspect that women attended women in much the same fashion in the Russias). The client will not accept Major or Minor changes to the name.

The following submissions appear in the August 2009 Atenveldt Letter of Intent:


This month's commentary is provided by Bronwen o Gydweli [BoG], Helena de Argentoune [HdA], Jeanne Marie Lacroix [JML], Kedivor Tal ap Cadugon [KtaC], Maridonna Benvenuti [MB], Michael Gerard Curtememoire [MGC], Nest verch Rodri ap Madyn [NRM], a number of heralds weighing in on Ciaran's name change and Marta [MMM].

Ælfwin Ironhair (Granholme): BADGE RESUBMISSION from Kingdom, May 2009: Per pale gules and Or, two scorpions counterchanged.

The badge was being held to clarify the ownership of it, and to determine a correct form of the household name. Harpy Herald provided a very long correspondence of potential household names with medieval Latin names, and I have forwarded that to the client; she wishes to submit the badge alone for the moment, under her registered name, and work on the household name at another time.

Beatriz Teixeyra Drago (Twin Moons): DEVICE RESUBMISSION from Laurel, April 2009: Gules, a flame and on a chief Or three gouts azure.

The name was registered April 2009.

The original submission, with the same blazon, was returned for redrawing: “ This is returned because the primary charge is not identifiable. Guesses from commentary included a shallot, an onion, and a bulb of garlic”. A redrawing has resolved this problem.

Bryce O'Neill (Twin Moons): NEW NAME and DEVICE: Per chevron azure and gules, on a chevron between three wolves rampant argent, three pairs of battle-axes crossed in saltire gules.

I like it as is. Would Lingua Anglica apply? Nice armory as well. [KtaC]

There's room enough to make the chevron MUCH wider, so that the crossed battle axes can be drawn significantly larger and thus more identifiable. Yes, that pushes the lower wolf down, but if he were left the same size he'd just fill the available space better, which would be another Good Thing. [MGC]

Agreed, but I don't think it's returnably bad. Of course Brickbat and/or Wreath are welcome to decide otherwise. [JML]

No style problems noted. Closest potential conflict is: Wojciek z Krakowa: Per chevron azure and gules, on a chevron between two crosses formy and an eagle argent a pair of compasses sable. There is one CD for changing the type of all secondaries and one CD for multiple changes (type, number and tincture) to the tertiaries. [BoG]

Caterina Giovanna da Monte (Twin Moons): NEW NAME and DEVICE: Per chevron azure and gules, three horses rampant in chevron and a fleur-de-lys argent.

No style problems noted. No conflicts found. Double given names were not unheard of late in period, and I found not conflicts. [BoG]

Claire de Beaumaris: NEW NAME and DEVICE: Or, a triple-towered castle and on a chief embattled azure three swans naiant Or.

I like the name and the armory. [KtaC]

No style problems noted. No conflicts found. No name conflicts found. [BoG]

Crespin Le Vasseur (Tir Ysgithr): NEW NAME

Ichijou Ichisaru Sukeaki: CHANGE OF HOLDING NAME from “William of Mons Tonitrus” and NEW DEVICE CHANGE: Sable, a monkey sejant gardant Or.

The field looks grey, is the actual submission black and this is just a computer glitch? The last name element is Sageaki, but in the 'citation' it's spelled Sukeaki. Which spelling is intended? By the way, I kind of like the monkey. [KtaC] The field is nice and sable on the forms themselves. [MMM]

"Sukeaki" is intended. I hope that's what I put on the forms. It's entirely possible that I had a brain fart when I filled them out and didn't catch it before I sent them on to Marta. (Ahh. Found the typo. It was in the email that I sent to Marta re. the submission. Definitely a brain fart on my part when I typed the name in the email as the forms have the name spelled "Sukeaki".) [HdA]

Re "Name Construction in Medieval Japan" by Solveig Throndardottir: Starting (I think) about the middle of the last century, there would sometimes be a triumphant cry of "ONLY in America!" when some cross-cultural success occurred. Surely this combination of subject and author-name is "ONLY in the SCA!"! And I, too, am charmed by the monkey. [MGC]

Well, the body of the monkey is very stylized, lacking the same interior detailing present in the head, but it’s still identifiable as such. This may be a Wreath call. Closest found was: Kyra Kai ferch Madoc, Sable, a monkey sejant erect affronty, in chief an annulet Or., with one CD for the posture of the monkey and a second CD for removing the annulet in chief.

No conflicts found with the name, but I rarely comment upon Japanese name formation. [BoG]

Isabella Evangelista (Windale): BADGE RESUBMISSION from Kingdom, July 2009: Per bend sinister ermine and checky gules and Or.

The name was registered September 2004.

The original submission, Per pale ermine and checky gules and Or., was returned for the appearance of marshalling (both since a Per pale line of division was used and that the Ermine. portion of the field, in such an arrangement, could be construed as the protected Arms of Brittany. Changing the line of division resolves these issues.

Ívarr haukr (Sundragon): NEW DEVICE: Gules, a hawk stooping Or between three arrows argent.

Melissa de Monstrum Aula (Barony of Atenveldt): CHANGE OF HOLDING NAME from “Melissa of Atenveldt”

One reference that I did find for a Roman house that seems to have the original name of the house is House of the Vettii, which was own by two brothers, A. Vettius Restitutus and A. Vettius Conviva, in “CLAS 220: The Roman House,” compiled by John Porter, University of Saskatchewan ( ); then again, this might just be a reference to the house based on inscriptions on the building rather than how it might've referred to at the time of its occupation. [MMM]

Mikael Thorson inn irski (Mons Tonitrus): NEW DEVICE: Azure, within a mullet voided and interlaced within and conjoined to an annulet argent a Thor's hammer Or.

Natal'ia Diekova vdova Rabynovicha (Granite Mountain): NEW NAME CHANGE from Natal'ia Diekova zhena Rabynovicha

Nest verch Rodri ap Madyn (Mons Tonitrus): NEW DEVICE CHANGE: Per bend sinister azure and vert, a mullet voided and interlaced within and conjoined to an annulet argent and an open book Or.

The biggest issue here, with the mullet voided and interlaced within and conjoined to an annulet now allowed to be registered, is whether this arrangement would be considered slot-machine heraldry, as was the case for Micahel Corey in the March 2009 LoAR: Per saltire azure and gules, in pale a pheon inverted within and conjoined to an annulet, and an anchor fouled with its line Or. “This was pended on the July 2008 LoAR to discuss whether the pheon and annulet were in the same charge group. Were they alone on the field, they would be considered a primary charge of a pheon and a surrounding secondary annulet. Commenters pointed out that the definition of a primary charge includes that it be the central, dominant motif. We are ruling that, since the pheon and annulet are not in the center of the design, they should be considered to be in the same group. Therefore, this design has three charges (pheon, annulet, and anchor) in a single charge group, and is returned for violating section VIII.1.a of the Rules for Submission, which says that "three or more types of charges should not be used in the same group."”

The March 2009 LoAR Cover Letter reiterated this “charge within an annulet” motif: “A widget within an annulet will continue to be considered a primary widget and a secondary annulet, or a primary annulet and secondary widget, when those charges are the only charges on the field. Which of the two charges is primary depends, as always, on the emblazon.

“When both are present in a design as part of a primary charge group, or where they would be expected to be a secondary charge, the widget and annulet will both be considered part of the same group.” In this case, if the mullet and annulet were considered two separate charges rather than a single charge (as in the case of a phoenix, which is a demi-eagle conjoined to a flame, but never counted as those two separate charges), then there are three dissimilar charges in the charge group: the mullet, the annulet and the book. This would be grounds for return.” I find no instance of any type of mullet within an annulet in Papworth's Ordinary (English armory), but I am sending this on, to see if members of the College might find this motif in other armories. If nothing else, this begins the discussion of whether this popular charge combination will be considered a “unified” single charge in the future, or two independent charges that one happens to see a lot. [MMM]

Osric of Blæcwōd (Barony of Atenveldt): CHANGE OF HOLDING NAME from “Osric of Atenveldt” from Laurel February 2007

Wow. I'm stumped. The only thing that I can suggest is that he be contacted to see if the meaning or the spelling is more important to him. If the meaning is maybe Blæcwudu can be suggested like you said, Marta. [MB]

The only information that I've found, which is not really documentation for Osric after 980, is in Reaney's The Origin of English Surnames, ISBN070028857, 1984, pp. 206-207, 'Compounds of -wright'. 'The Wright was a carpenter or joiner...Some names in -wright go back to OE personal names in -ri-c which in ME underwent various irregular developments, occurring as -rich, -richt...which is often confused with -wright: rick, too, is a common delvelopment...Goodrich, Goodwright (Godri-c)...OE Bealdri-c, which survives as Baldridge...Boldright...Boldwright whilst the curious Horsewright noted in Suffolks (John Horsewright, Robert Horsewreath 1524 SRSf) is probably from OE O-ri_c. The surname is not well evidenced but may be the modern Ostridge, Ostrick, though this is certainly sometimes for ostricer 'a keeper of goshawks, hawker, falconer'. For the Suffolk Horsewright, we may compare the modern Orsborn for Osborn and Horsegood for Osgood...' R&W, s.n. Ostridge lists the origin as a keeper of goshawks, hawker, falconer. I haven't found any later, variant spellings of Osric and if we did it would be a 'Major change' which doesn't allow. [MB] That part of the name has been registered to him, so I think the issue is to get the byname to match or at least be temporally compatible. [MMM]

Further consultation with the client: “Let's go ahead and submit it as Blæcwōd, it being easier for heralds and others to get to at least sound like Blackwood, or Schwarzwald, which is what all this started as....and then use Blæcwudu as a reluctant second choice that would be ok.” [MMM]

Saba Ó Coilean (Atenveldt): NEW NAME and DEVICE: Azure a horseshoe, inverted and winged, within a bordure Or.

Why the commas in the blazon? [MGC]

It's missing a comma after the field. Otherwise, it's a style I tended to use in blazoning (setting of descriptive parts by using commas). I was often talked out of it during proof passes and in this case they probably should be removed. [JML]

For the blazon, try Azure, horseshoe inverted winged and a bordure Or. This is clear of Richenda de Braundeston ,(Fieldless) A horseshoe inverted Or, winged argent. There is one CD for changes to the field, a second CD for changing the tincture of the wings, and a third CD for removing the bordure. But I believe it to be a conflict with Phelan Ó Coileáin, Azure, a horseshoe inverted within a bordure Or. There's one CD for adding the wings, but everything else is identical. [BoG] As noted, the lady is the sister of Phelan is has a Letter of Permission to conflict. [MMM]

I gather this is a Lady with a masculine name, though I must assume she knows that. [BoG] Yes, you are correct. She's used “Saba” as a name for years and is more interested in a name with that sound rather that its gender. [MMM]

The spelling of the byname will be corrected in the LoI, and the blazon is likely to be adjusted.

Ségán Ó Catháin (Tir Ysgithr): NAME and DEVICE RESUBMISSION from Kingdom, June 2009: Quarterly vert and sable, a wing argent.

Originally submitted as Lughán Ségháncathán, there were several questions as to the construction vs. a “classic” Irish Gaelic name. Upon consultation with the client, he was fine with dropping the first name and using the other elements in a standard construction.

The name is Irish Gaelic. Ségán appears in “Index of Names in Irish Annals: Masculine Given Names,” Mari Elspeth nic Bryan ( ) as an Oghamic Irish (pre-700) masculine name. Séaghán is a modern form of the name, found in Irish Names by Ó Corráin and Maguire (pp. 163-4 s.n. Ségán). Cathán is a masculine given name also found in “Index of Names in Irish Annals: Masculine Given Names,” as Middle Irish Gaelic and dated 914-1036; the genitive form is shown as Catháin. (There might be a step from period practice in combining Oghamic Irish with Middle Irish Gaelic). The client desires a male name and is most interested in the meaning of the name, with Ségán and Cathán originally coming from the terms for “hawk” and “battle,” respectively.

Seloue McDaid (Twin Moons): NEW NAME

Seloue is a feminine given name dated to 1202, found in The Anglo-Saxon Heritage in Middle English Personal Names, East Anglia 1100-1399 II, Bo Seltén, p. 134 s.n. Sælufu. The client is the legal daughter of Seamus McDaid. His name was registered December 1999 and so it can be used by her under the grandfather clause. MacDade/MacDaid is found in Black, p. 485, a Scots family name.

The client desires a female name and is most interested in the sound and spelling of the name. She will not accept Major Changes to the n to be either compound byname, or has been used as a last name for men. (Still not sure how that works). On the plus side though, after being unable to find the right page (I actually bought the book on Alibris) it turns out I bought vol 1 not realizing there was more than one. She cited vol 2. I'll keep looking. If anything different shows up I'll let you know.” So, as the two of us have merrily bumbled along with this long enough, I'm forwarding the submission to Laurel, where I'm sure more experienced members of the College of Arms can weigh in. [MMM]

Willelmus Macmanus (Brymstone): CHANGE OF HOLDING NAME, “Willelmus of Brymstone,” July 2009

Further correspondence with the client regarding the spelling of the byname and permitted changes, if they become necessary for registration:

“ It would be acceptable to change the capitalization, but as far as a changing of the lettering, I would not wish to do so. It has a personal significance.
Macmanus or MacManus, either would suffice. And (possibly) McManus, if neither of the former will pass.” Hence, the spelling of the byname cannot be changed. And since Mc- is a scribal abbreviation (see January 2008 LoAR for Hamon MacPhersone: “Submitted as Hamon McPhersone, precedent requires that the scribal abbreviation Mc be expanded before it can be registered. We have changed the name to Hamon MacPhersone in order to register it.”), what would be registered is one of the Mac- forms, closer to the form he desires. [MMM]

I’m not sure this is a conflict, but consider: Liam McManus: this name was registered in October of 1990 (via Ansteorra). Liam is a diminutive of William. Willelmus is a Latinized form of the same name. [BoG] Oh, gee whiz... I found a Precedent set down during Francois' tenure:

“Nebuly raises the issue that Nikolai Kowal is a Latin documentary form of the registered name Kouac Myclos. However, the standard for name conflict against registered names is not whether two names are documentary variants of each other in different languages but rather, "Two name phrases are considered significantly different if they differ significantly in sound and appearance." The exception is diminutives of the same name, which do conflict. The RfS explicitly address Latin versus. vernacular forms, V.I.ii says: "Cum Barba is significantly different from Beard and Witheberd 'with the beard', but Beard is equivalent to Witheberd." In this case, although the two names have the same meaning, they are written in different languages, and are significantly different in sound and appearance. Therefore, they are not in conflict. [Nikolai Kowal, LoAR 01/2005, Æthelmearc-A]” [MMM] I would then say that Willhelmus appears to be a documentary form, and would thus likely NOT conflict with Liam. Thanks, Marta. This was just something I thought needed checking prior to Laurel level. [BoG]

The following submissions were returned by the Atenveldt CoH for further work, August 2009:

Ascelina Alánn ingen Ailella (Twin Moons): BADGE RESUBMISSION from Laurel, January 2009

(Fieldless) On a flame proper a bat-winged unicorn rampant argent, breathing flames Or.

I couldn't see the flames Or until I looked closer. I would suggest drawing them a bit larger. Also the unicorn is on a flame proper? The way it's drawn seems more like a flame paly Or and gules. I'm a bit confused by this. [KtaC]

1. That's a badge? Awfully complex, isn't it?

2. That's a "flame proper"? Surely there's no such thing when fieldless, because that can't determine whether the outside edge is Or or gules. Rather, it is: On a flame [if you can call it that] Or 6 pallets wavy gules and overall a winged unicorn . . .--which is metal on metal, no?

    3. He's "breathing flames"? I don't suppose they count for any CD, but still, I too would like to be able to see them without being alerted by a blazon! [MGC]

Complexity count of 5 (flame, Or, gules, unicorn, argent), so that's not a bar to registration. SCA badges fall under the same complexity rules as devices. As to period badges that's a different issue. What I do see as a bar is the Or flame on a flame proper. The lack of contrast is grounds for return. Foxes proper of argent or ermine have been returned recently for similar lack of contrast.

Besides, it conflicts with Dorren of Ashwell (10/2002, East), "(Fieldless) On a flame proper, a heart argent." There's a CD for fieldlessnes but nothing for changing the type only of the charge as a flame is not a suitable charge under X.4.j.(ii).

(Re a flame proper) It's a flame proper - it doesn't matter what tincture the outer flame is. The criteria is simply alternating gules and Or flames. A flame proper by definition is neutral, so the argent unicorn is allowed.

(Re an Or flame on a flame proper) As noted above, those flames are grounds for return. Ahh... a relevant precedent:

"This device is returned for lack of contrast: flames proper cannot be placed on Or or gules, as by definition they are half Or and half gules." [Boris Nemtsov, 06/2007] If you can't place flames proper on Or, you can't place Or on a flame proper. [JML]

This looks less like a flame proper than a flame paly (sort of) wavy.  The fact that the bat-winged unicorn is incensed is a very minor detail, and I wouldn’t in fact have noticed it without being told, so I don’t think contrast is a real issue with that, since the inflaming Or is all upon a gules trait anyway. The unicorn is, I believe, sufficiently goat-like to avoid the unicornate horse ban, but I just have problems with the flame.

Checking for conflict: Alaric Erskin, (Fieldless) Upon a flame proper, an ermine spot sable.( One CD for fieldlessness, One CD for multiple changes (type and tincture) to the tertiary, so Clear); Gabrielle Sternschauer, Argent, on a flame azure a primrose Or seeded gules. (One CD for changes to the field, One CD for multiple changes (type and tincture) to the tertiary, so Clear.); But Dorren of Ashwell, (Fieldless) On a flame proper, a heart argent. (One CD for fieldlessness, but we cannot get a second CD for changing only the type of the tertiary, because the flame is not a suitable charge for application of X.4.j.ii. For armory that has no more than two types of charge directly on the field and has no overall charges, substantially changing the type of all of a group of charges placed entirely on an ordinary or other suitable charge is one clear difference. Only the new submission is required to meet these conditions in order to benefit from this clause. A charge is suitable for the purposes of this rule if (a) it is simple enough in outline to be voided, and (b) it is correctly drawn with an interior substantial enough to display easily recognizable charges. A flame is too complex a charge to be voided or fimbriated, so we need two changes to the tertiary to get a second CD, and I count only the one for type. This is a conflict.). [BoG]

RETURNED for conflict, and for insufficient contrast between the flame breathed by the unicorn and the flame on which it lies.

Ciaran Bashshar al'Hashim ibn'Harb ibn'Badb bint'Macha bint'Moirrioghan al'Eriu MacBhloscaidh (Twin Moons): NEW NAME CHANGE

RETURNED for incorrect name formation.

Lily Del Sol (Barony of Atenveldt): NAME and DEVICE RESUBMISSION from Kingdom, March 2004

Ermines, a phoenix displayed gules charged with a fleur-de-lys argent.

I found a listing for "Sonne" dated 1327 in Reaney and Wilson. There are six people with the name of "Lilie" listed in the O and A. Since "sonne" is german for "sun" the client could go for the name of Lilie Sonne. [NRM]

HELD for work on name, and for insufficient contrast of the charge on the field.

The following submissions were registered by the S.C.A. College of Arms at its May 2009 meetings:

Ælfwin Ironhair. Badge. Sable, in fess a human skull facing to sinister and a bottle bendwise sinister inverted argent.

Bearach Black. Name and device. Per chevron sable and vert, two caltraps and a lion rampant tail nowed Or.

Submitted as Bearach Black of Clan Lamont, bynames of the form of Clan X have been disallowed for over a decade:

... the construction of Clan X has been disallowed since June 1998. [Aeron Aschennen of Clan MacKenzie, 05/00, R-Ansteorra]

There are several problems with the name...there is no evidence of the use of Clan <X> in names... [Brenna Michaela Sine Macghie of Clan MacKay, 04/00, R-Atenveldt]

No new documentation was provided for the use of of Clan X bynames, so they continue to be unregisterable. The LoI noted that if of Clan Lamont was not registerable, the submitter would accept of Lamont instead. However, of Lamont is not a correct construction. Black, The Surnames of Scotland, s.n. Lamond derives Lamont or Lamond not from a place name but from Old Norse l{o,}gmaðr 'lawman, lawyer'. As an inherited surname, Lamont cannot be combined with the inherited surname Black because of this precedent: No documentation was provided and none found for multiple inherited surnames in Scots in period. Barring such documentation, double inherited surnames in Scots are not registerable. Names of the form "given+surname+of locative" are common in the 16th C. As Leslie is originally a locative byname, we would change this name to Robert MacAlister of Leslie. However, the submitter will not accept major changes such as reordering the name phrases. We note that Robert Leslie and Robert MacAlister are both registerable forms of this name. [Robert Leslie MacAlister, LoAR 01/2005, Atenveldt-R] As the submitter allows all changes, we have dropped the problematic element to register the name as Bearach Black_. This name combines Gaelic and Scots, which is a step from period practice.

Diana de Winchecumbe. Name and device. Sable, two lightning bolts in saltire surmounted by a pegasus segreant argent.

Nice 13th C English name! The use of lightning bolts by themselves, and not as part of a thunderbolt, is a step from period practice. Please instruct the submitter to draw the pegasus so that the legs are not aligned with the lightning bolts, to promote identifiability.

Draco Havenblast. Name and device. Per pale sable and gules, a dragon passant within an orle argent.

The given name Draco was documented from Seibicke, Historisches Deutsches Vornamenbuch. However, no photocopies were provided for this source. As Seibicke is not listed on Appendix H of the Administrative Handbook, failure to provide copies is grounds for return. In this case, we are able to register the name because Siren provided alternative documentation for the name: In 9/08, <Draco of Brockore> was registered on the basis of these docs: "The given name is documented from the name of Draco Malafortini who appears dated to 1435 - 1455 in a list of prebendaries of Ratfyn derived from the Fasti Ecclesiae Anglicanae 1300 - 1541, Volume III Salisbury Diocese, pp. 79 - 82 which can be found online at" Using this documentation, this name combines English and German, which is a step from period practice.

Ewout Gheretssoen. Device. Quarterly per fess wavy barry wavy azure and argent and gules, two comets bendwise sinister inverted argent.

Sabiha al-Nahdiya. Name change from Sibilla of Atenveldt.

Submitted as Sabiha al-Nahdiyah, this used two different transcription systems in the same name, representing the same Arabic letter with both a and ah. Since the given name uses the a version, we have changed the byname to al-Nahdiya in order to register the name. We note that the transcription Sabihah al-Nahdiyah is also registerable. Her previous name, Sibilla of Atenveldt, is retained as an alternate name.

Safiya bint Ahmad ibn Abdullah. Name (see RETURNS for device).

Submitted as Safaya bint Ahmet ibn Abdullah, the submitter requested authenticity for a 16th C Mamluk born in Egypt. No documentation was provided for the spellings Safaya or Ahmet, and none could be found by the commenters. For a 16th C Mamluk born in Egypt, the standard medieval Arabic spellings of the name should be appropriate; these are Safiya and Ahmad. We have changed the name to Safiya bint Ahmad ibn Abdullah in order to register it and to meet her request for authenticity.

The following submissions have been returned by the College of Arms for further work, May 2009:

Jerome the True. Device. Vert, two scarpes erminois.

Sadly, this gorgeous armory must be returned for conflict with Harold of Kenneydell, Vert, two bendlets sinister sable fimbriated argent. There is a single CD for the change of tincture of the scarpes; there is nothing for removing the fimbriation.

Safiya bint Ahmad ibn Abdulla. Device. Azure, in pale an ostrich plume quill pen fesswise and a decrescent argent, an orle of roses Or.

This device is returned for lack of identifiability. The charge in chief was blazoned as an ostrich plume quill pen on the Letter of Intent, but none of the commenters could identify it as such. The resemblance of the charge to an alembic flask was far too strong. On resubmission, the submitter should draw the charge clearly as either a quill pen (with a visible nib and most of the vanes removed so it can be held comfortably) or as an alembic flask.

Marta as tu Mika-Mysliwy

c/o Linda Miku

2527 East 3rd Street

Tucson AZ 85716

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