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Kingdom of Atenveldt Home Page

Kingdom of Atenveldt
Heraldic Submissions Page

(administered by the Brickbat Herald)


Unto Their Royal Majesties Phelan and Amirah; Duchess Elzbieta Rurikovskaia, Aten Principal Herald; the Heralds in the Atenveldt College of Heralds; and to All Whom These Presents Come,

Greetings from Marta as tu Mika-Mysliwy, Parhelium Herald!

This is the August 2008 Atenveldt Letter of Presentation. It precedes the external Letter of Intent that will contain the following submissions that are presented here, asking questions of submitters and local heralds who have worked with them; if these questions are not addressed, the submission may be returned by the Atenveldt College of Heralds. I accept online commentary, in addition to questions pertaining to heraldry and consultation. The last day for commentary on the submissions considered for the August 2008 Letter of Intent is 20 August 2008.

New Forms, New Fees: Don't forget that there are NEW submissions forms, downloadable from, and from the Kingdom of Atenveldt website. USE THESE FORMS ONLY! Do NOT “use up” your old forms! Submissions on those are likely to be returned to you, to transfer the information from them onto the NEW FORMS.

Also remember that as of 1 July 2008, submissions fees for new items have been reduced in the Kingdom of Atenveldt. The fee for a new name, device or badge is $7.00/item. Local heralds will retain $2.00/item for use in the running of their local offices; the remainder ($5.00) should be sent on to the Parhelium Herald's Office via a check or money order made payable to “Kingdom of Atenveldt, SCA, Inc.” Thanks!

Submissions Website: You can send electronic commentary on the most recent internal LoIs through the site, in addition to any questions you might have. Current submission forms (the ONLY forms that can be used) can be found on the site. Please let your local populace know about the site, too:

Please consider the following submissions for the August 2008 Atenveldt Letter of Intent:

Anton DeWitt (Granholme): NEW DEVICE

Per fess azure and argent, a bull's head cabossed argent and a frog sejant affronty vert.

Although the device submission notes that a name is submitted with this device submission, only a device submission was received. Even if there are no problems with this submission, I can't do anything with it until a name submission is received. (The forms used are also obsolete ones and used color photocopying, which is prohibited.)

Ascelin àlainn inghean Ailill (Twin Moons): NEW NAME and DEVICE

Per fess azure and argent, a dragon segreant counterchanged.

Acelina is an early English feminine given name from the Old French A(s)celine. Aceline is dated to 1195 as Aslin, and 1195, 1205 and 1210 as Ascelina; this is found in “Feminine Given Names in A Dictionary of English Surnames, Part Two: The Names A-G.”

Talan Gwynek ( ). NOTE: I'm using this citation because it, as opposed to the articles currently listed in the Medieval Names Archive, doesn't require photocopies, just the title/author/URL in the documentation space on the name submission form. Be sure to check and see if a MNA paper is mirrored onto the site; if it is, use the citation of the latter, so you don't have to send up photocopies of the MNA article. This situation is supposed to be rectified in the (near) future, but for the nonce, it is creating a lot of additional paper and postage. The client believes (I think) the name to be Scots, but I cannot find a citation this early (to match the father's name) that is Ascelina or a variant of that name; she might consider the feminine given name Aeschine, dated to 1170 (and as Eschine c. 1160) and found in “12th Century Scottish Women's Names,” Tangwystyl verch Morgant Glasvryn ( ), which is a documented Scottish name.

The remainder of the name is Irish Gaelic. Ailill is an Irish masculine given name found in “100 Most Popular Men's Names in Early Medieval Ireland,” Tangwystyl verch Morgant Glasvryn ( ...note that this is another mirrored article. Yay!), dated to roughly pre-12th C. The genitive form is listed as Ailella. àlainn is Irish Gaelic for “beautiful,” found in An Etymological Dictionary of the Gaelic Language, Aelxander McBain, Garim Publications, 1982 (, ). The construction of the name follows the patterns seen in “Quick and Easy Gaelic Names Formerly Published as "Quick and Easy Gaelic Bynames,” 3rd Edition, Sharon Krossa ( ), using inghean to show the relationship between daughter and father and the placement of a descriptive element. Hence, “Beautiful Ascelin daughter of Ailill.” The client will accept Ascelina if Ascelin cannot be registered (I would think that Ascelin is close enough in pronunciation to the dated alternate Aslin to be considered). The client desires a female name and is most interested in the meaning and the sound of the name, “beautiful dream/dreamer,” a person of mixed Irish and Scottish ancestry. She would like the name to be authentic for an individual having a Scottish mother and an Irish father. (I'd tend to lean toward the Scottish Aeshine or Eschine if that's the desire.) The name Aislinn and its variants pops up in the “Problem Name Project,” just as a matter of interest ( ).

Christiane Dax (Twin Moons): NEW BADGE

(Fieldless) A skull sable jessant of a shakefork gules.

Johnathan Whitewolf III (Barony of Atenveldt): NEW NAME and DEVICE

Per pale gules and sable ermined throughout, a wolf rampant argent.

The name is English. The client desires a male name and will not accept Major or Minor changes to the name.

Sara Blackthorne (Barony of Atenveldt): NEW NAME CHANGE from Sara Rebecka Chadburn and NEW DEVICE
Argent, on a heart gules a key fesswise reversed wards to base Or and in chief a staff sable entwined by a vine vert thorned sable. ““Early examples include <de Blackthorn> 1276, <Blakethorn> 1379, <Blakthorn> 1442 [3]. The word appears as <blacke-thorn> in 1496, <blacke thorne> in 1578, and <blacke-thorne> in 1634...(When written as a single word, the name is unlikely to have retained the <-e> at the end of <blacke>.)” ( ). The client desires a female name. She wishes to retain her currently-registered name Sara Rebecka Chadburn, registered January 2008, as an alternate name.

I'm hoping that the current placement can be unequivocally be blazoned as “in chief” for the staff...the alternative of making these co-primaries (Argent, in pale a staff sable entwined by a vine vert thorned sable and a heart gules charged with...) might run into an issue (but I don't think so...I think) of three co-primaries: the heart, the staff AND the vine. She is using an element from the registered armory of her husband, William Griffin Blackthorne, Gules, a griffin's head contourny couped on a chief argent a staff entwined with a leafless vine thorned sable.

Tabitha Whitewolf (Barony of Atenveldt): NEW NAME and DEVICE

Gules, a wolf queue-forchy rampant argent between three four-leaf clovers Or.

Tabitha is a header in Withycombe; the entry says this is the Aramaic equivalent of Dorcas. "Both names appear in Acts IX for the charitable woman who was raised up by St. Peter. Tabitha, like Dorcas, was common in the 17th century..." It is dated to 1584 in Mari Elspeth nic Bryan's "Names in Chesham, 1538-1600/1" ( / ). It is also the client's legal given name. She has written permission from her legal father-in-law John F. Scott, who has the registered SCA name of Johnathan Crusadene Whitewolf, to use the byname. The construction of the byname is not dissimilar from English bynames that combine <color> + <artifact, animal>, or a period inn-sign that combines a color descriptive with an animal (Grayhorse, Grayhound, Whitehorse, Whitelamb, all found in “English Sign Names,” Mari Elspeth nic Bryan ( )). The client desires a female name and will not accept Major changes to the name.

Vincenzo Antonio Maria Pace (Twin Moons): NEW NAME and DEVICE
Argent, two rapiers crossed in saltire sable surmounted by a rose purpure and on a chief azure five mullets argent.

The name is Italian. Several names with the construction of <masculine given name> + <masculine given name> + <masculine byname> are found in 15th Century Italian Men's Names,” Talan Gwynek ( ) and in “Milanese Notaries 1396-1635, “ Maridonna Benvunti ( ). While a name with a third given name has yet to be documented, it doesn't seem especially unreasonable, and might be considered a step from period practice. Vincenzo and Antonio are masculine given names found in “Italian Renaissance Men's Names,” Ferrante LaVolpe ( ); Pace is a patronymic, found in the same source. The original source of these names is the Online Catasto of 1427 ( ). Maria is a feminine given name found in “Feminine Given Names from the Online Catasto of Florence of 1427,” Arval Benicoeur ( ). It's very nice to have all the elements found in the same historical source! The client desires a masculine name and is most interested in the language/culture of the name (none given, but I strongly suspect Italian). If absolutely, positively necessary, the client would allow “Maria” to be dropped in order to register the name.

The following submissions appear in the July 2008 Atenveldt Letter of Intent:

Annya Sergeeva (Tir Ysgithr): NEW DEVICE: Argent, three eggs gules each charged with a Latin cross bottony argent, on a chief gules a cat couchant argent.

Love the usage of the Latin cross bottony. Very elegant. [HdA]

Anna Sergeeva: NEW BADGE, held jointly with Robert Heinrich: Argent, an egg gules charged with a Latin cross bottony argent within a torse wreathed Or and sable.

Dulcia le Fey (Tir Ysgithr): NEW NAME and DEVICE

Per bend sinister purpure and argent, three butterflies argent and a tree eradicated proper.

The name is English. Dulcia is a feminine given name dated to 1275 under Douce in “Feminine Given Names in A Dictionary of English Surnames, Part Two: The Names A-G,” Talan Gwynek ( ). Margaret le Fey is dated to 1332 in Reaney and Wilson's A Dictionary of English Surnames, 3rd edition, p. 165, s.n. Fay.

Ered Sûl, Barony of: NEW ORDER NAME “Order of the Mountain Flame” and NEW BADGE: Azure, on a mountain of three peaks vert, fimbriated and snow-capped argent, a torch Or.

I would say that there are “mountain flames” – or at least, there were. The San Francisco peaks where Ered Sul is located are dead volcanoes. The pockets of ignitable natural gas usually associated with such things would argue for the possibility, that’s for sure. I think this would be better in the possessive as “Mountain’s Flame” myself. ( But would “Mountain’s Former Flame” be more appropo? Nah….) [HdA] The period grammar would be Mountains Flame, and I think I like this form as well. (I think the alternative is just a little, um, “awkward,” like the “Mountain's Former Flame But We're Still Good Friends”...) [MMM]

I would like to see the torch larger so that it can be seen better. As it is, it’s hard to identify online. No conflicts found, aside from the Barony’s existing badges. [HdA]

Felipe Cuervo (Granite Mountain): NEW HOUSEHOLD NAME, House Fénix de Oro

Name: Using “Casa” instead of “House” in this mostly Spanish name would be a fine thing as it would make the name “entirely” Spanish instead of “mostly” Spanish. [HdA]

Leah ingen Padraig (Tir Ysgithr): NEW NAME and DEVICE: Per saltire or and argent, three domestic cats courant in annulo gules.

Personally, I would like to see the cats’ bodies curve more so that they are “really” in annulo, but that’s kind’ve a niggle as they are plainly in annulo as drawn. No conflicts found. Closest was Rand the Silvermith: Sable, three African leopards passant in annulo proper. 1 CD for the field + 1 CD for the tincture of the primary charge = 2 CDs à clear. [HdA]

Luke Walker of Skye (Mons Tonitrus): NEW NAME and DEVICE: Per pale Or and purpure, in pale three castles counterchanged.

Name: So, the client is a Star Wars fan, I take it? While documentable, its really waaaaaay to close to the moden pop culture reference of “Luke Luke.Skywalker” for me to be comfortable with it. I think the name is fun (really! Id do. It makes me giggle.), but, well, let’s be honest, we’ve got enough “Star Wars” references around here as it is. (“Estrella War,” for example. “Estrella being Spanish for “star.”) Do we want to encourage more?

All that aside, I do think this is a great name for a character in a Commedia del Arte play, but I am highly doubtful that this is a registerable name simply because of the obvious modern reference. There are lots of documentable names out there that are not registerable simply because of their modern contextual meaning due to either (a) obscenity or (b) modern culture/pop-culture reference or (c) presumption due to name being too famous. I think this falls under both categories (b) and (c). [HdA]

Luke Skywalker eh? Just tell me that his castles do not look like light sabers. [SK]

Conflict with Luke Skywalker from the Star Wars trilogy. [MB] Upon further consultation with the client, if the name must be changed (most likely an element dropped), he would accept Luke Walker, nice as the elements are just over 60 years of each other. [MMM]

Marius Pelagius Calvus (Atenveldt): NAME and DEVICE RESUBMISSION from Laurel, January 2008: Per chevron inverted gules and azure, a Latin cross formy and a bordure dovetailed argent.

The client has sufficiently addressed the reason for return in both cases. [HdA]

Morgana Quarry (Granholme): NEW BADGE: (Fieldless) An opinicus segreant purpure.

Lovely badge. No conflicts found. Closest are: Anne De Witte: Ermine, a griffin salient within a bordure purpure. (1 CD for fieldlessness and 1 CD for removing the bordure); Alyson Throckmorton: Lozengy vert and Or, an alphyn passant purpure. (1 CD for fieldlessness and 1 CD for posture); and Mæva in raudha Steingrímsdóttir: Paly argent and gules, a gryphon passant guardant purpure. (1 CD for fieldlessness and 1 CD for posture). [HdA]

Ragnarr skinnskrifari í Bládrekafirði (Atenveldt): DEVICE RESUBMISSION from Kingdom, October 2001: Ermine, a dragon rampant contourny azure maintaining an awl and a human skull sable within a bordure per bend sinister sable and azure.

This submission resolves the prior tincture violation. I found no conflicts. Closest is:

Aillen Gunn: Ermine, a dragon segreant contourny purpure. 1 CD for adding the bordure + 1 CD for changing the tincture of the primary charge = 2 CDs à clear.; and Patrice of the Misty Fjords: Argent, a wyvern erect contourny azure grasping the the blade a sword inverted sable, a bordure azure. 1 CD for field tinctre + 1 CD for tincture of the peripheral ordinary = 2 CDs à clear. [HdA]

Seamus O'Callan (Granite Mountain): NEW NAME and DEVICE RESUBMISSION from Kingdom, December 2007: Per pale vert and Or, a vol and in chief between the tips a tricune, all counterchanged.

This is really pretty. On “tricunes:” A tricune (Lat.: "triple wedge") is a geometric figure formed of three passion-nails conjoined in estoile at the heads. (HB, 5 Feb 72 [50], p. 1) [The term appears to be a neologism.]

"Tricune" is an old Germano-Norse design that may also be described as "three passion-nails cojoined in estoile at the heads.' (IoL, 14 Jan 73 [58], p. 16)” [ ]

The “tricune” still seems to be SCA-compatible as the latest registration is from 2005, for Derich Brauer: Quarterly argent and gules, two tricunes gules.

No conflicts found. Everything was 3pts away. [HdA]

Ulrich Gottfried (Granite Mountain): NEW NAME and DEVICE: Per bend sinister sable and argent, a bend sinister gules, in dexter chief a cross of annulets braced Or.

Device: This is neat and kinda different! I do wish he’d gone for the most excellent contrast of counterchanging the bend sinister over the line of division instead of going for the red bend sinister, but c’est la vie. Color me amazed. No conflicts found. [HdA]

I don't mind the use of the red ordinary; it's a good example, with decent enough contrast, to demonstrate how a neutral field it used. [MMM]

Vincent Matthew of Kilkenny (Barony of Atenveldt): NEW NAME

The following submissions were held/returned for further work by the Atenveldt CoH, July 2008:

Melissa of Monster Hall (Atenveldt): NEW NAME and DEVICE: Argent, a winged Gorgon's head cabossed proper, crined and with serpents vert, and a bordure embattled sable.

Name comments: I do not believe that this name is registerable under the current RfS.

There are exactly two registrations of the word”monster” in a name of any sort – both of those are screamingly old:

· Ladies Auxil iary of the Monsters This household name was registered to Denis of the Titans in June of 1980 (via Atenveldt).

· Monsters of Monster Hall This household name was registered to Denis of the Titans in January of 1973.

What documentation did she provide to prove that “of Monster Hall” is registerable? In light of our current knowledge about the formation of names, I am uncertain of the registerability of “of Monster Hall.” While Count Denis and his mundane blood heirs and granted the right to use this appellation via the Grandfather Clause, that right does not transfer to non-blood relatives. Permission to conflict while nice to have is insufficient to prove registerability under the current RfS.

Generally speaking, names of creatures – both real and fantastical -- found in Inn Sign names and other sorts of names can all be found in Heraldic devices (dragon, demon, cat, dog, wolf, gryphon, etc). The term “monster,” however, is a category of creatures (including dragons, gryphons, etc) and not very specific in that sense. (conclusion extrapolated from reading this article on English Inn Sign names: , which includes Inn Signs using “dragon” and “mermaid” as well as “horse” and “lamb.” ) Given this, I don’t believe that the term “monster” is specific enough to be registerable.

Then there’s the question of using the word “Hall” to describe a castle or building pre-1600. A fine example of using this term in a placename or to describe a “house” is “Haddon Hall” in England which dates to the 9th C. The official website for the house is here: (It’s purrrrrty!) “Haddon Hall is probably the finest example of a fortified medieval manor house in existence. Present-day Haddon Hall dates from the 12th Century to the early 17th Century, whereupon it lay dormant for over two hundred years from 1700 until the 1920s, when the 9th Duke and Duchess of Ru tland restored the house and gardens, and once again made it habitable.” [] [HdA]

I'm holding this as I think about this. These are interesting issues (particularly the nasty Grandfather Clause/blood relative thing). Monster comes into the English language in the 13th C., so that still holds promise, but as the device is being held, the client might as well be made aware of potential problems with her name submission, too. [MMM]

Device comments: The argent wings are invisible against the argent field. They need to be some non-metal tincture on this field in order to be seen, especially since they are of a size to be considered co-primary with the head. If the wings were of a size to be considered “maintained,” they would still need to be a tincture other than argent since while maintained charges are allowed to have minimal contrast, they must have “some” contrast.

Additionally, “wings” are not an integral part of the definition of “a gorgon’s head,” therefore they must be considered as a co-primary charge. Those wings are really bugging me. As it stands, the majority of the charge is white-on-white not green on white. The only green parts are the snakey “hair,” which, as drawn is clearly not the majority tincture on the charge.

Although the embattlements are nicely place, the bordure is really too skinny and the embattlements need to be as high as they are wide.

I really think she needs to pick tinctures other than “proper” in order to make this registerable. What’s wrong with an all green winged gorgon’s head? (Aside from the client not liking it, that is.) If she really, really wants the charge proper, how ‘bout changing up the field tinctures?

The more I think about it, the more I want to get that bordure out of there. The charge is really big and busy. In order to get more identifiability on the outline of the head, the wings need some more room to stretch out. [HdA]

This will have to be redrawn, at least to make a correct bordure embattled. I'd like to see the wings removed (partially for the tincture issue) or drawn as one draw period winged objects (essentially wings displayed, and solving the tincture problem). I don't think these are insurmountable problems, but I will contact the client with suggestions. [MMM]

HELD for charge clarification/modification.

Marta as tu Mika-Mysliwy

c/o Linda Miku

2527 East 3rd Street

Tucson AZ 85716

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