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Kingdom of Atenveldt Home Page

Kingdom of Atenveldt
Heraldic Submissions Page

(administered by the Brickbat Herald)

ATENVELDT COLLEGE OF HERALDS 1 October 2011, A.S. XLVI
LETTER OF PRESENTATION Kingdom of Atenveldt


Unto Their Royal Majesties Arthur and Gabriela; Master Seamus, Aten Principal Herald; the Heralds in the Atenveldt College of Heralds; and to All Whom These Presents Come,

Greetings from Marta as tu Mika-Mysliwy, Brickbat Herald and Parhelium Herald for the Kingdom of Atenveldt!


This is the October 2011 Atenveldt Letter of Presentation. It precedes the external Letter of Intent that will contain the following submissions that are presented here, asking questions of submitters and local heralds who have worked with them; if these questions are not addressed, the submission may be returned by the Atenveldt College of Heralds. Where there any submissions this month, know that I accept online commentary, in addition to questions pertaining to heraldry and consultation. You can send commentary to me privately at brickbat@nexiliscom.com or join “Atenveldt Submissions Commentary” at Yahoo! Groups ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Atenveldt_Submissions_Commentary/ ) and post there. (Commentary is often posted in the next month's Letter of Presentation so that all may learn from it, and we can see how additional documentation or comments may have influenced a submission. Please don't be shy!)

Please have commentary to me for the submissions under consideration for the October 2011 Atenveldt Letter of Intent by 13 October 2011. Thanks!


Heraldry Hut: The next Heraldry Hut will be held Friday, 21 October. For more information, directions, etc., please contact me at your convenience ( brickbat@nexiliscom.com ).


Speaking of submissions: I accept direct-to-Kingdom submissions from heraldic clients; this might not be the most favorable route to take, particularly if a group has a territorial herald, and everyone can stay more in the “submission loop” if a submission is made in this fashion. However, in some cases, this is the only reasonable and timely way for a submission to be made. Local heralds need to send submissions on in a timely manner as well (i.e., within one month of receiving a submissions packet). If you cannot connect with me at an event (very likely) or attend Heraldry Hut, submissions need to be mailed within one month (yes, that's important!) of a local herald receiving them, unless there is a reason for return at the local level. My address: Linda Miku, 2527 E. 3rd Street, Tucson AZ 85716.


Kingdom A&S Consultation Table: There will be a Kingdom level Consultation Table at Kingdom Arts and Sciences in Tir Ysgithr, Saturday, 1 October. If you have clients who need additional consultation, if you'd like to hang wit' da heralds, or if you or other folks have status questions, etc., please drop by!


Submissions Website: You can send electronic commentary on the most recent internal LoIs through the site, in addition to any questions you might have. Current submission forms (the ONLY forms that can be used) can be found on the site. Please let your local populace know about the site, too: atensubmissions.nexiliscom.com.


College of Arms Results: The Atenveldt portion for the S.C.A. College of Arms July 2011 Letter of Acceptance and Returns (Atenveldt's April 2011 LoI) is found at the end of this report.


Please consider the following submissions for the September 2011 Atenveldt Letter of Intent:


Clarice Alienor Neep (Tir Ysgithr): NEW BADGE

(fieldless) A turnip proper within and conjoined to an annulet purpure.

The name appears in the July 2011 Atenveldt Letter of Intent.


Dubhchobhlaigh inghean an Bháird uí Néill (Tir Ysgithr): NEW DEVICE

Per chevron vert and sable, two lanterns and an owl rising wings addorsed maintaining in its talons a rolled scroll argent.

The name was registered December 2010.


Trian Ruadh Mac Colmain (Tir Ysgithr): NEW NAME

Trian is a masuline Irish Baelic given name found in “100 Most Popular Men's Names in Early Medieval Ireland,” compiled by Heather Rose Jones ( http://www.s-gabriel.org/names/tangwystyl/irish100/ ). Ruadh is a descriptive byname meaning “read (hair or coloration). Usually the descriptive byname follows the given name, as cited in “Index of Names in Irish Annals: Masculine Descriptive Bynames,” Mari Elspeth nic Bryan ( http://medievalscotland.org/kmo/AnnalsIndex/DescriptiveBynames/ ). mac is the Irish Gaelic particle meaning “son of, forming a simple patronymic byname ( “Quick and Easy Gaelic Names,” Sharon Krossa, http://medievalscotland.org/scotnames/quickgaelicbynames/ ). Colmáin is the genitive form of the masculine Middle Irish given name Colmán, dated 700-1200 AD, cited in “Index of Names in Irish Annals: Colmán,” Mari Elspeth nic Bryan ( http://medievalscotland.org/kmo/AnnalsIndex/Masculine/Colman.shtml ). The name would probably be a little more accurate if the diacritical were used in the byname. The client is most interested in the language/culture of the name (none given but strongly assume Irish) and doesn't care about the gender of the name. She will not accept Major changes to the name.


Yashka the Nomad (Tir Ysgithr): NEW ALTERNATE NAME, Icka the Goth, and NEW BADGE

Or, a fox's mask between three leaves in pall inverted stems to center purpure and a bordure vert.

The name was registered July 2009.

Icka is a 8th Century feminine Hispano-Gothic name found in Hispano-gotisches Namenbuch, J.M. Piel and D. Kremer (Heidelberg: Carl Winter Universita:tsverlag, 1976). It is cited in the Academy of Saint Gabriel Report 1928 ( http://www.panix.com/~gabriel/public-bin/showfinal.cgi/1928.txt ). The same report notes that “In almost all records, Goths are identified by single given names alone,

without any surname (Woolf, Henry Bosley, The Old Germanic Principles of Name-Giving (Baltimore: Johns Hopkins Press. 1939), ch. 14)). That would probably be the most typical way for a woman of that culture to identify herself, especially before the Muslim invasion.” and “a foreign writer might have referred to a Goth as "the Goth". We have found strong evidence that in Iberia after the fall of the Gothic kingdom, bynames with this meaning were used.”

The following submissions appear in the September 2011 Atenveldt Letter of Intent:

Commentary was provided by Elnor Howard, Helena de Argentoune, Séamus mac Ríáin and Marta as tu Mika-Mysliwy.


Arianwen ferch Arthur (Tir Ysgithr): NEW HOUSEHOLD NAME, Teulu Caer Mab, and NEW BADGE: Per pale argent and azure, a lozenge counterchanged.


Ariel Longshanks (Tir Ysgithr): DEVICE RESUBMISSION from Laurel, June 2011: Argent, a natural dolphin haurient and a sea-lion respectant purpure.

The name was registered June 2011.

The original submission was returned for redraw; a natural dolphin has a dorsal fin, which was missing from this emblazon and that greatly hampered the identifiability of the charge: “This is a violation of section VII.7.a of the Rules for Submissions, which requires that "Elements must be recognizable solely from their appearance."” This has been corrected.


Asher Tye (Barony of Atenveldt): NEW NAME and DEVICE: Per pale sable and Or, a tree eradicated and a chief all counterchanged.


Caillech ingen Cú Dubh (Barony of Atenveldt): NEW NAME

The name is Irish Gaelic. The given feminine name was registered to Caillech ingen Tuathail in February 2001: "Submitted as Cailleach ingen Thuathail, the submitted documentation only supported the compound form Cailleach <Saint>, not Cailleach. Orle, however, found some isolated 8th century examples of the name element in the form Caillech. We have therefore changed the given name to match the documented solitary form."

Cellach is also found in "Index of Names in Irish Annals: Cellach," Mari Elspeth nic Bryan ( http://www.medievalscotland.org/kmo/AnnalsIndex/Feminine/Cellach.shtml ), which shows this as the standard form of an old Irish feminine name associated with annalistic dates of 726, 729 and 732 with a single raw data instance of this spelling in the name Caillech ingen Dunchadha under the date 732. This tends to make it an Old Irish Gaelic name (c. 700-c. 900). “Index of Names in Irish Annals: Cú Dub / Cú Dhubh,” Mari Elspeth nic Bryan ( http://medievalscotland.org/kmo/AnnalsIndex/Masculine/CuDub.shtml ), doesn't show an Old Irish Gaelic form of the name (Middle Irish Gaelic is Cú Dub/Con Duib), but there is an annalistic date for Cú Dubh, mac Maol Fabhaill, toiseach Cairrge Brachaighe dying in 1014. It is one step from period practice for the combination of Old Irish and Middle Irish Gaelic name elements. Based on the information from Mari's article, I think the patronym should be ingen Cú Duib, in its genitive form. We use the particle ingen found in the citation for Caillech ingan Dunchadha. The client desires a female name, and is most interested in the language/culture of the name (approximately 11th C. Irish). She would like it authentic for 10th-12th C Irish.


Caoilfhionn ingen ui Máel-ruanaid (Mons Tonitrus): NEW NAME and DEVICE: Or, a wood-handled half-moon knife proper and a chief engrailed azure.

The client's herald tells me that she is most interested in maintaining the spelling of Caoilfhionn as the first name.


Colm Kile of Lochalsh (Granholme): ALTERNATE NAME RESUBMISSION, Colm Gobiforn Storm, from Laurel, July 2011

The primary persona name was registered November 1993.

The client's original alternate name submission, Colm before the storm, was returned because “the byname before the storm has several issues. The documentation is based on a pattern of locative bynames based on generic toponymics, like Overwater or Byfield. The submitter presented no evidence, nor could any be found, that before was used in this sort of locative byname. He presented no evidence that storm is the sort of element found in this sort of byname. Barring this evidence, it cannot be registered. The submitter may want to consider the documented byname Gabyfore or Gobiforn 'go before' (the first from Jonsjo, the second from Reaney and Wilson) and the documented byname Storm. But we suspect that Colm Gobiforn Storm would not create the effect he intends. Therefore, we are returning this to allow the submitter to consider what he would prefer to do.” The client has decided to accept the suggestion offered by the College and use a double byname. Gobiforn is found under Gobbett in Reaney and Wilson, 3rd edition, p. 194, dated to 1212 and glossed as “go before.” Storm is dated to 1206 and 1297 in the same source, p. 430 s.n. Storm. This is early for a double byname, but it does offer him some option to the alternate name he'd like.


Honour Grenehart (Granholme): BADGE RESUBMISSION from Kingdom, July 2011: Argent, on a chief embattled sable four mullets Or.

The name was registered January 1999.

The original submission, Argent on a chief embattled sable three mullets Or., was returned for conflict with Jean Amy, registered February 2008, Or, on a chief embattled sable three mullets argent. There is 1 CD for the difference in field tinctures, but there aren't two cumulative differences in the tertiaries on the chief to provide the second CD (types, number and orientation are identical; the only difference is in tincture). Changing the number of mullets now provided two cumulative changes to the tertiary groups (four Or vs. three argent), which creates the second CD.


Iosif Volkov (Sundragon): DEVICE RESUBMISSION from Laurel, June 2011

Per chevron argent and azure, two wolves combatant each maintaining a Latin cross azure and a double-headed axe argent.

There was an error on the June 2011 LoAR, and the client's name change, from Iosif Volchkov to Iosif Volkov, should have been registered (it will appear on an Errata letter, and Iosif Volchkov is retained as an alternate name).

The original device submission, Per chevron argent and azure, two wolves combatant each maintaining an axe azure and a double-headed axe argent., was returned as the CoA does not grant a CD for difference between single-headed and double-headed axes, and so the device was returned for violating the "sword and dagger" rule, by using two similar but non-identical charges in the same design. The client has changed the maintain charges to Latin crosses.


Margerita da Ferrara (Mons Tonitrus) NEW NAME and DEVICE

Per bend sinister purpure and vert, a sun and on a chief Or a grape vine vert fructed purpure.

The name is Italian. The given name differs in spelling on the name and device form (Margerita vs. Margherita). It seems that the two documentable forms of the name are Margherita and Margarita, so she might want to go with Margherita. Plus! The spelling Margherita is noted in the article used following ( http://www.s-gabriel.org/names/arval/venice14/venice14sur.html#women ). Da Ferrara, “of Ferrara,” is a locative surname found in “Fourteenth Century Venetian Personal Names,” Arval Benicoeur and Talan Gwynek ( http://www.s-gabriel.org/names/arval/venice14/venice14sur.html#table ); Ferrara is about 50 miles southwest of Venice. The client desires a female name and is most interested in the language/culture of the name (Italian). She will not accept Major changes to the name.


Reinhardt Konrad von Rothenburg (Tir Ysgithr): NEW NAME and DEVICE: Or, a scorpion inverted gules.


Rose Ella Duvanovicha doch' Sychevna (Brymstone): DEVICE RESUBMISSION from Laurel, December 2010: Per pale argent and sable, two harpies close addorsed counterchanged.


Rose Ella Duvanovicha doch' Sychevna: NEW BADGE: Per fess vert and Or, three trees couped in fess Or, and a European eagle owl proper.


Uilliam of Iona (Tir Ysgithr): NEW DEVICE: Per pale purpure and sable, a tankard argent between three pheons Or.

The name was registered June 2011.


Varga János (Twin Moons) : DEVICE RESUBMISSION from Kingdom, September 2010: Azure, a wolf sejant erect affronty argent maintaining in his dexter paw a lantern Or and sustaining in his sinister paw a spear Or, tipped sable, upon a trimount vert.

Commenters looking at the colored submission form thought that the sustained charged was a staff; none of them could see the small sable spearhead against the azure field.

The following submissions were registered by the SCA College of Arms, July 2011:

`Ā'isha al-Zakiyya bint Yazīd al-Mayūrqī . Name.

This is transcribed in the Armorial as `{A-}'isha al-Zakiyya bint Yaz{i-}d al-May{u-}rq{i-}.

Alister Stewart. Name and device. Quarterly sable and azure, on a cross argent three triskeles in fess sable.

Submitted as Alistair Stewart, no documentation was presented that this spelling (as opposed to the name itself) was used in period. The spelling Alister is dated to 1531 in the Records of the Parliaments of Scotland to 1707. We have changed the name to that dated spelling in order to register it. We note that we were unable to find any examples with -stair that are not modernized. Please instruct the submitter to draw the triskeles larger to better fill the available space.

Anastasia filia Maguch. Device. Argent, on a bend sable between two bouquets of lilac blossoms purpure slipped and leaved vert banded purpure a peacock feather Or.

These are bouquets not sheaves; under current precedent, a sheaf is considered shorthand for an arrangement of two charges in saltire and another in pale, whereas the depiction of these lilac blossoms complete with a bow gives the clear visual impression of a single charge, a bouquet. For reproducibility's sake, we wish to note that there are three blossoms in each bouquet in this submission, but visually each bouquet is a single unit; thus there are only two secondary charges, not six.

Arthur O'Flaherty. Badge. Or, on a sun gules a dragon contourny argent, a bordure gules.

Bran mac Padraig of Antrim. Name change from holding name Bran of Twin Moons.

Submitted as Bran_Padraig of Antrim, this name has the same problem as the identical submission returned in July 2008. We have no evidence for the use of two given names in Gaelic. Therefore, this cannot be registered as is. The submitter has made it clear that he does not want to drop the element Padraig. That gives two possibilities. First, we can make the second byname into a patronymic byname, giving Bran mac Padraig of Antrim. Second, we can make the name the partially Anglicized Bran Patrick of Antrim. As the first retains the spelling of the submitted elements, we have changed the name to that form in order to register it. Antrim is found as an English spelling in the grey period. It can alternately be seen as a lingua Anglica form of a Gaelic locative byname.

Caryn Isolde Clothilde von Katzenberg. Reblazon of device. Per chevron azure and vert, a chevron argent between a sun Or and a domestic cat dormant argent.

Blazoned when registered in June 1975 as Per chevron azure and vert, a chevronel argent between in chief a sun in glory and a domestic cat dormant argent, the position and tincture of the secondary charges is being clarified. Under current blazon standards, the sun in the original blazon would be argent and have a face.

Colm Kile of Lochalsh. Badge (see RETURNS for alternate name). Per bend sinister sable and azure, an Aeolus bendwise sinister contourny argent and overall two scarpes Or.

Helena de Argentoune. Alternate name Helen Welez and badge. (Fieldless) A wagon wheel per bend sable and gules enflamed Or.

Johann der Becker von Aschersleben. Name.

The placename Aschersleben is found on the 1570 Ortelius map. Commenters questioned whether we had evidence of an occupational byname with an article followed by a marked locative byname. Ælfwynn Leoflæde dohtor was able to provide examples: Hainricus dictus der Becke zu Hayingen 1271 (Brechenmacher s.n. Beck) and Heinrich der weber von Altkilch 1298 (Socin p 311 s.h. de Altkilch). A combination meaning "the baker of Aschersleben" is not presumptuous, as there is no reason to expect a single official baker of a city.

John Ailewrde. Device. Per pale vert and gules, in pale three wolves dormant contourny argent.

Kedivor Tal ap Cadugon. Alternate name Oygudei Chagan Bar.

Raffaelle de Mallorca. Alternate name Robert Loud of Great Snoring.

Laurel precedent says that you cannot use the submission fees from a returned primary name to register another item (such as a badge). However, the basis of this ruling is that the provision of a holding name is itself a registration, and allowing the resubmission to be used to register a second item (as opposed to a replacement for the holding name) is unfair. In this case, the submitter is requesting that the fees used for a returned badge be used for this submission. As the submitter received no registration for the money, this case is not comparable, and the monies can be used for a submission of another type. Submitted as Robert Loud of Greater Snoring, commenters could find no evidence that Greater Snoring was used as a placename before the 19th century. However, commenters could construct the location Great Snoring. The change from Greater to Great is a minor change, which the submitter allows. Therefore, we have made that change in order to register the name.

Stephan MacGrath. Name change from holding name Stephan of Atenveldt.

Tanne Atzler. Name.

Nice 15th century German name!

Tomyris Benenati. Name (see RETURNS for device).

Tomyris was ruled registerable as a literary name in Italian contexts in March 2011.

Wolffgang von Luxemburg. Name.

Submitted as Wolffgang Von Luxemburg, no evidence could be found for capitalizing the preposition. Therefore, we have made it lowercase in order to register the name.



The following submissions were returned by the College of Arms for further work, July 2011:


Caoilinn inghean Fhaelchon. Name change from Duncan of Kilernan.

This name has several issues. First, the spelling Caoilinn has not been proven to be period. It is the modern form of the name of a saint who lived in the 6th or 7th century. The forms for Old or Middle Gaelic contexts are Caelfind or Caelainn (these forms and the others given here omit accents, as names in Gaelic may be registered with or without them). In the grey period Martyrology of Donegal, the name appears as Caoil Fiond, Caellainn and Caoilfionn. Faelchon is the genitive (possessive) form of the name of a 7th century saint. In the grey period Martyrology of Donegal, the name appears as Faolchu (whose genitive should be Faolchon). The name has several temporal incompatibility issues. First, the byname combines the Early Modern Gaelic inghean with the Old Gaelic Faelchon (which must be lenited to Fh- because of the requirements of Gaelic grammar). The Rules for Submissions require each name element to be linguistically and temporally consistent. Thus, this could be registered as the Early Modern inghean Fhaolchon or the Old Gaelic ingen Fhaelchon, but not as the linguistically mixed inghean Fhaelchon. We would change the byname, but changing the language in this way is a major change, which the submitter does not allow. This name would be registerable as a completely Early Modern Gaelic Caellainn inghean Fhaolchan or a completely Old Gaelic Caelainn ingen Fhaelchon (as well as the other dated spellings of the given name. However, either of these is a major change, which is more than the submitter allows. Therefore, the name must be returned.

Colm Kile of Lochalsh. Alternate name Colm before the storm.

While we appreciate the submitter's desire to find a registerable joke name, we remind him that names, joke or otherwise, must be documented. If he'd like to see some well documented ones, he can check out the many April 1 letters in OSCAR. In this case, the byname before the storm has several issues. The documentation is based on a pattern of locative bynames based on generic toponymics, like Overwater or Byfield. The submitter presented no evidence, nor could any be found, that before was used in this sort of locative byname. He presented no evidence that storm is the sort of element found in this sort of byname. Barring this evidence, it cannot be registered. The submitter may want to consider the documented byname Gabyfore or Gobiforn 'go before' (the first from Jonsjo, the second from Reaney and Wilson) and the documented byname Storm. But we suspect that Colm Gobiforn Storm would not create the effect he intends. Therefore, we are returning this to allow the submitter to consider what he would prefer to do.

Tomyris Benenati. Device. Azure vetu ployé, a lucy naiant embowed counterembowed argent.

While you can blazon your way out of a style problem, you cannot blazon your way out of a conflict. Under current precedent, vetu fields must also be checked as a lozenge throughout. This device therefore has a conflict with Kareina Talvi Tytar, Azure vetu, a longhaired domestic cat dormant argent. Considered as a charged lozenge instead of a field division, there is only one CD for change in type of tertiary charge. Likewise, this is also a conflict with the device of Josephus Piscator, Argent, on a lozenge azure a compass star throughout Or. There is only one CD for the multiple changes to the tertiary charge. Please note that many commenters confused this fish with a heraldic dolphin. Lucies and other similar fish are typically shown straight, not embowed counterembowed as in this depiction. It should be remembered that lack of identifiability is itself grounds for return.


Marta as tu Mika-Mysliwy

c/o Linda Miku

2527 East 3rd Street

Tucson AZ 85716

brickbat@nexiliscom.com

atensubmissions.nexiliscom.com





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